Policy talk:Universal Code of Conduct/Enforcement guidelines
Scope
The UCoC has a role as an optional fallback for those projects which don't have their own standards. Attempting to impose it on large, established communities such as English Wikipedia against consensus is just another power grab which will drive away editors. Certes (talk) 10:26, 11 September 2022 (UTC)
Agree, UCoC should not apply on enwik, as enwiki can handle itself. Rockstone35 (talk) 10:54, 11 September 2022 (UTC)
- 100%, allow large wikis a ratification vote. This should be in each wiki's usual format (on en-wiki and I suspect on most others that means a community initiated, written, and closed RFC). If they ratify it, cool, we dotted is and crossed ts. If they don't, we dodge a minefield where communities are asked to abide by/enforce standards that don't have consensus. Tazerdadog (talk) 14:30, 11 September 2022 (UTC)
- Note that UCoC itself is already approved as a global policy (see foundation:Universal Code of Conduct), and it technically already applies at all Wikimedia wikis. The discussion here is about the enforcement guidelines, rather than UCoC itself. Martin Urbanec (talk) 17:50, 11 September 2022 (UTC)
- It's been approved by the WMF, which unilaterally asserts the right to override policies "local" to much larger communities such as enwp. It will be interesting to see how that claim works in practice. Certes (talk) 21:59, 11 September 2022 (UTC)
- The UCOC has not been ratified by the en.wiki community and therefore doesn't have consensus there. I expect they're developing a complete proposal with enforcement mechanisms fully documented before they ask us to ratify it, and I appreciate that. I do trust there won't be an attempt at an end-run around community ratification.S Marshall (talk) 23:49, 11 September 2022 (UTC)
Enforcement by type of violations
There is nothing directly specifying UCoC violations by WMF staff & contractors, BOT, Working Groups or Committees. While its highly unlikely that people in some of the roles would cause an issue, its only fair that there be some recourse mentioned in this section for those areas. Aka Affcom oversees affiliates but who oversees Affcom, what if the Language committee denies a language because of racism, or a funding committee denies a community/individual without performance of certain actions? The way committees are developing with single regional representatives as the conduit for access, the shift to hybrid event like the Summit where a select few have access has opened the door for corruption. The current layout appears to create a set of untouchables in the movement, further enhancing that potential. There more WMF systems move off wiki the deeper these untouchables are able to cement power. Gnangarra (talk) 12:27, 11 September 2022 (UTC)
Minor syntactical issues
- "See definition on Meta": As the link points to the definition on Meta, not Meta('s main page?) itself, the linked text should be "definition" or "definition on Meta". The current linking style is discouraged by dewiki and enwiki ([1], [2]).
- There is one too many newlines / paragraph breaks between "4.1 Purpose and scope" and "4.2 Selection, membership, and roles". ToBeFree (talk) 19:31, 11 September 2022 (UTC)
First, of all thank you for your work in removing the most problematic parts. Second I have a suggesting for this section: Why must it always the UCoC, that is linked, if local texts like e.g. de:Wikipedia:Wikiquette exists. Of Course it has not the status of a policy, but it has nice recommendations in it, which are easy to understand. Habitator terrae (talk) 00:09, 12 September 2022 (UTC)
Privacy
About the previous version I stated, that the sentence "The privacy of a case should be determined not only by those charged with resolving the case, but also with input from those who raised the initial report." could touch the praxis by the dewiki arbcom, to only have public cases. Do I understand correctly (in the dewiki), that now in cases, where somebody has a need for an arbcom and wants his privacy accepted, this first comes before the U4C, which then checks, whether there are privacy concerns. If yes itself decides the case, if not it is forwarded to the dewiki arbcom? Habitator terrae (talk) 00:17, 12 September 2022 (UTC) PS: Why don't you call the U4C "interwiki arbcom"?
- I am speaking only for myself and not for the revisions committee or any other member of the committee. As the person who came up with the name U4C, I intentionally wanted something other than an arbcom. In my mind the Universal Code of Conduct Coordinating Committee should be doing more Coordinating than Arbitrating. And no if someone wants privacy they may continue to use an ArbCom, as long as local policy allows that. Best, Barkeep49 (talk) 03:11, 12 September 2022 (UTC)
Confirming adherence
The new text is a lot better IMO, thank you for revising it. What is the plan for how the listed groups of people will "confirm their adherence to the UCoC"? Is this something yet to be decided or did I miss it somewhere? Legoktm (talk) 04:28, 12 September 2022 (UTC)